Lpc2000

I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a Xilinx
Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The
FPGA will be configurable via the '2106 which will have a suitable serial
flash device connected to it for storing the configuration data. All '2106
I/Os will be connected to the FPGA and the remaining FPGA I/Os will be
brought out to connectors. It'll have an RS-232 port and JTAG for the '2106.
I probably won't bother with the JTAG for the FPGA.

Is anyone else intererested in this?

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

At 11:32 AM 12/17/03 +0000, you wrote:
>I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a Xilinx
>Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The
>FPGA will be configurable via the '2106 which will have a suitable serial
>flash device connected to it for storing the configuration data. All '2106
>I/Os will be connected to the FPGA and the remaining FPGA I/Os will be
>brought out to connectors. It'll have an RS-232 port and JTAG for the '2106.
>I probably won't bother with the JTAG for the FPGA.

Sounds intriguing Leon.  Unfortunately, I've no idea what I'd do with it, 
nothing I've done has required that sort of logic.  It's either been best 
done (integrated) on the micro, slow enough that the micro is more than 
fast enough or simple enough to be done with a few discrete gates or a 
simple PLD like a 22V10.  I'd love to hear what kind of use it got put to 
though.

Robert

BTW, (OT but others may run into similar problems) I think I've tracked 
down the problems I was having with group mail arriving wildly out of order 
and widely delayed.  There appears to be plenty of blame to spread 
around.  I think most of the delays were either sporadic overloads on the 
system or more likely something at my ISP.  In addition, however, as a 
check on this I subscribed via a different e-mail provider and changed the 
address in Yahoo.  The interface would not change the delivery address (It 
claimed it had but all the mail was sent to the previous address), Yahoo 
had to manually intervene.  I also subscribed via a third address and I've 
since unsubscribed from that one but e-mail keeps coming through on it 
anyway (even with a confirmation that I unsubscribed)


" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

                         Kelvin Throop, III

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Robert Adsett" <subscriptions@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 2:44 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


> At 11:32 AM 12/17/03 +0000, you wrote:
> >I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a
Xilinx
> >Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The
> >FPGA will be configurable via the '2106 which will have a suitable serial
> >flash device connected to it for storing the configuration data. All
'2106
> >I/Os will be connected to the FPGA and the remaining FPGA I/Os will be
> >brought out to connectors. It'll have an RS-232 port and JTAG for the
'2106.
> >I probably won't bother with the JTAG for the FPGA.
>
> Sounds intriguing Leon.  Unfortunately, I've no idea what I'd do with it,
> nothing I've done has required that sort of logic.  It's either been best
> done (integrated) on the micro, slow enough that the micro is more than
> fast enough or simple enough to be done with a few discrete gates or a
> simple PLD like a 22V10.  I'd love to hear what kind of use it got put to
> though.
>

It may be used for lots of things: co-processor, DSP, NCO, video processing
etc.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

Hi Leon,

This kind of thing would be great for many things considering there's so
much more CPU
power now. I'd have quite a few apps in mind, but the downer with Xilinx is
that the IP
is not safe when booting like that. I've never really looked further. I
prefer FPGAs that are
Flash based, or in many cases a large CPLD will do. Can't have them all I
guess.

Do you have a way to protect the IP for the FPGA ? I don't even know if
Xilinx provides
for encrypted booting on the Spartan etc.

-- Kris

> > Sounds intriguing Leon.  Unfortunately, I've no idea what I'd do with
it,
> > nothing I've done has required that sort of logic.  It's either been
best
> > done (integrated) on the micro, slow enough that the micro is more than
> > fast enough or simple enough to be done with a few discrete gates or a
> > simple PLD like a 22V10.  I'd love to hear what kind of use it got put
to
> > though.
> >
>
> It may be used for lots of things: co-processor, DSP, NCO, video
processing

> etc.
>
> Leon
> --
> Leon Heller, G1HSM
> Email: aqzf13@...
> My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
> http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "microbit" <microbit@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:18 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


> Hi Leon,
>
> This kind of thing would be great for many things considering there's so
> much more CPU
> power now. I'd have quite a few apps in mind, but the downer with Xilinx
is
> that the IP
> is not safe when booting like that. I've never really looked further. I
> prefer FPGAs that are
> Flash based, or in many cases a large CPLD will do. Can't have them all I
> guess.
>
> Do you have a way to protect the IP for the FPGA ? I don't even know if
> Xilinx provides
> for encrypted booting on the Spartan etc.

One or two techniques spring to mind, like an encrypted bit stream in the
flash memory. Once it's in the FPGA it's pretty safe. Xilinx has got quite a
lot of info on security, it's an important consideration for many customers.
I've never needed to bother with it, myself.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

Hi Leon,

> I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a
Xilinx
> Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The

It could be useful, but if you're continuing to develop this as a
platform, I _personally_ would rather see a single standardized CPU
board with 100 mil headers, and a variety of mezzanines available to
plug directly onto those headers. I.e. build up, not out. Also it means
you can keep the boards 2-layer where possible, to save cost.

-- Lewin A.R.W. Edwards (http://www.zws.com/)
Learn how to develop high-end embedded systems on a tight budget!
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0750676094/zws-20

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Lewin A.R.W. Edwards" <larwe@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2003 3:57 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


>
> Hi Leon,
>
> > I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a
> Xilinx
> > Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The
>
> It could be useful, but if you're continuing to develop this as a
> platform, I _personally_ would rather see a single standardized CPU
> board with 100 mil headers, and a variety of mezzanines available to
> plug directly onto those headers. I.e. build up, not out. Also it means
> you can keep the boards 2-layer where possible, to save cost.

I've already done something like that for a client, I don't want to compete
directly with them. For small boards like this the additional cost for four
layers is negligible, and they are much easier to design.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

> > It could be useful, but if you're continuing to develop this as a
> > platform, I _personally_ would rather see a single standardized CPU
> > board with 100 mil headers, and a variety of mezzanines available to

> 
> I've already done something like that for a client, I don't want to
compete
> directly with them. For small boards like this the additional cost for
four

Fair enough. The main thing for me is, I don't really need multiple
development systems with overlap, so I'd prefer to pay once for a CPU
module and then a smaller incremental cost for each add-on module. Also
if the modules were stackable, I could prototype more exotic systems if
needs be, without too much wirewrap insulation on the floor... But no
matter.


-- Lewin A.R.W. Edwards (http://www.zws.com/)
Learn how to develop high-end embedded systems on a tight budget!
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0750676094/zws-20

At 12:57 17-12-2003, you wrote:

>Hi Leon,
>
> > I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 and a
>Xilinx
> > Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in mind. The
>
>It could be useful, but if you're continuing to develop this as a
>platform, I _personally_ would rather see a single standardized CPU
>board with 100 mil headers, and a variety of mezzanines available to
>plug directly onto those headers. I.e. build up, not out. Also it means
>you can keep the boards 2-layer where possible, to save cost.

  Our "ARMermelator" project aims toward that. The main board consists of 
an AT91 processor, Flash memory, SRAM and an XC2S50E/XC2S100E FPGA, all in 
a 3"x2" format board. All IO pins of the MCU and FPGA are shared and 
exported through two 60-pin 2mm headers, which makes prototyping and module 
insertion easy. For our in-house projects, we are currently designing 
modules with Analog IO, RS232/485, Ethernet, RF, CF, GPS interfaces.

  The board supports stacked modules or can be used with a backbone. For 
that purpose, modules also have an AGP132 edge connector to be inserted in 
this backbone (up to 14 modules). Modules are automatically recognized at 
powerup by the main board through a simple serial interface.

  We considered Philips ARM MCUs for the main board, but the lack of an 
external bus in the current devices was very limiting, specially if you 
want to plug cheap modules with memory mapped interfaces. We are planning 
to design some modules with the Philips MCUs, though. I hope the MCUs with 
an external memory interface are available soon. Does anyone know if they 
will have RAM controllers?

  We are also planning to offer our board as a kit (main board + JTAG 
programmer + prototyping module) for something between US$150~US$200. Since 
all FPGA pins are exported, the board also can be used as an FPGA kit if 
the processor is not soldered in. Would anyone be interested in buying 
something like that? The idea would be to put up a site where people can 
share their code, designs, etc. Something like an ARM-based open-source ZWorld.

  We are open to ideas... Cheers!

--- In lpc2100@yahoogroups.com, "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@h...> 
wrote:
> I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106 
and a Xilinx
> Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in 

Great. I started gathering info to make a board exactly like that 
early new year.

But I'd go for a Spartan 3, XC3S200-4TQ144. Samples are available, 
and they will shortly give much more bang for the buck.
You can scale down to S50 or up to S400.

If you go with Spartan3, please state so: I'd immediately buy two 
PCBs.

Being that for development, I'd surely add pads for FPGA Jtag, even 
if not in the standard 2x10 connector. Really useful to develop FPGA 
(Chipscope, etc).

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "pasini_antonio" <pasini.a@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 6:51 AM
Subject: [lpc2100] Re: LPC2106 and FPGA


>
> --- In lpc2100@yahoogroups.com, "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@h...>
> wrote:
> > I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106
> and a Xilinx
> > Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in
>
> Great. I started gathering info to make a board exactly like that
> early new year.
>
> But I'd go for a Spartan 3, XC3S200-4TQ144. Samples are available,
> and they will shortly give much more bang for the buck.
> You can scale down to S50 or up to S400.
>
> If you go with Spartan3, please state so: I'd immediately buy two
> PCBs.
>
> Being that for development, I'd surely add pads for FPGA Jtag, even
> if not in the standard 2x10 connector. Really useful to develop FPGA
> (Chipscope, etc).

I was thinking of using the Spartan3, but wasn't sure about availability.
I'll look into it.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

At 03:08 PM 12/17/03 +0000, you wrote:
>It may be used for lots of things: co-processor, DSP, NCO, video processing
>etc.
Ah, I guess I'm too used to doing power and control.

BTW, Leon, you are leaking e-mail addresses.  I havn't seen it on other 
messages so I suspect it may have something to do with you being the moderator.

Robert

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Robert Adsett" <subscriptions@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 2:23 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


> At 03:08 PM 12/17/03 +0000, you wrote:
> >It may be used for lots of things: co-processor, DSP, NCO, video
processing
> >etc.
> Ah, I guess I'm too used to doing power and control.
>
> BTW, Leon, you are leaking e-mail addresses.  I havn't seen it on other
> messages so I suspect it may have something to do with you being the
moderator.



I think my Hotmail address is getting spoofed by people who've got a virus.
I don't think I can do anything about it.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

At 02:54 PM 12/18/03 +0000, you wrote:

>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Robert Adsett" <subscriptions@...>
>To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
>Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 2:23 PM
>Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA
Actually I was referring to the address above (the address of the person 
you reply to, not yours).

Robert

" 'Freedom' has no meaning of itself.  There are always restrictions,
be they legal, genetic, or physical.  If you don't believe me, try to
chew a radio signal. "

                         Kelvin Throop, III

--- In lpc2100@yahoogroups.com, "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@h...> wrote:
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "pasini_antonio" <pasini.a@t...>
> To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 6:51 AM
> Subject: [lpc2100] Re: LPC2106 and FPGA
> 
> 
> >
> > --- In lpc2100@yahoogroups.com, "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@h...>
> > wrote:
> > > I am thinking of designing a little 4-layer PCB with an LPC2106
> > and a Xilinx
> > > Spartan XC2S200 on it, for one or two applications I've got in
> >
> > Great. I started gathering info to make a board exactly like that
> > early new year.
> >
> > But I'd go for a Spartan 3, XC3S200-4TQ144. Samples are available,
> > and they will shortly give much more bang for the buck.
> > You can scale down to S50 or up to S400.
> >
> > If you go with Spartan3, please state so: I'd immediately buy two
> > PCBs.
> >
> > Being that for development, I'd surely add pads for FPGA Jtag, even
> > if not in the standard 2x10 connector. Really useful to develop FPGA
> > (Chipscope, etc).
> 
> I was thinking of using the Spartan3, but wasn't sure about
availability.
> I'll look into it.

The Spartan3 isn't available, and no-one seems to know when they will
be (I think that Xilinx is having problems getting them made). I'll
stick with the Spartan II for now, I can get them OK.

Leon

----- Original Message -----

From: "microbit" <microbit@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 2:18 AM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


> Hi Leon,
>
> This kind of thing would be great for many things considering there's so
> much more CPU
> power now. I'd have quite a few apps in mind, but the downer with Xilinx
is
> that the IP
> is not safe when booting like that. I've never really looked further. I
> prefer FPGAs that are
> Flash based, or in many cases a large CPLD will do. Can't have them all I
> guess.
>
> Do you have a way to protect the IP for the FPGA ? I don't even know if
> Xilinx provides
> for encrypted booting on the Spartan etc.
>
> -- Kris

Could always use one of the actel flash fpgas.

Or store the  config encrypted and have the decoder and or key in the fpga
with
a battery back up.
Xilinx have app notes on a few different ways of doing it.

I can dig a few up(links) if anyone wants.

Alex

Hi Alex,

I've been told the Actel Flash FPGAs are quite good. One day I might look
into
that, but it needs to have a free synthesis/fitting (at the least) tool for
VHDL
development to try it.
I don't particularly like the idea of my system core sitting in RAM in an
FPGA,
for various reasons, but anywho.

I'm told by a collegue that Altera nowadays have VHDL free as well as part
of Quartus or MaxPlusII or whatever.
Any comments there Leon, I remember you've used Altera extensively before.

A long while ago I started synthesising a PIC core for the hell of it.
With a 16 bit bus, the whole thing fitted 90% of a 256 macrocell CoolRunner.
I started on a VHDL core of MSP430, but lost interest ..

Anyway, back to LPC2100 I guess :-)

Cheers,
Kris



----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Gibson" <alxx@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 9:42 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "microbit" <microbit@...>
> To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2003 2:18 AM
> Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA
>
>
> > Hi Leon,
> >
> > This kind of thing would be great for many things considering there's so
> > much more CPU
> > power now. I'd have quite a few apps in mind, but the downer with Xilinx
> is
> > that the IP
> > is not safe when booting like that. I've never really looked further. I
> > prefer FPGAs that are
> > Flash based, or in many cases a large CPLD will do. Can't have them all
I

> > guess.
> >
> > Do you have a way to protect the IP for the FPGA ? I don't even know if
> > Xilinx provides
> > for encrypted booting on the Spartan etc.
> >
> > -- Kris
>
> Could always use one of the actel flash fpgas.
>
> Or store the  config encrypted and have the decoder and or key in the fpga
> with
> a battery back up.
> Xilinx have app notes on a few different ways of doing it.
>
> I can dig a few up(links) if anyone wants.
>

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "microbit" <microbit@...>
To: <lpc2100@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, December 19, 2003 9:51 PM
Subject: Re: [lpc2100] LPC2106 and FPGA


> Hi Alex,
>
> I've been told the Actel Flash FPGAs are quite good. One day I might look
> into
> that, but it needs to have a free synthesis/fitting (at the least) tool
for
> VHDL
> development to try it.
> I don't particularly like the idea of my system core sitting in RAM in an
> FPGA,
> for various reasons, but anywho.
>
> I'm told by a collegue that Altera nowadays have VHDL free as well as part
> of Quartus or MaxPlusII or whatever.
> Any comments there Leon, I remember you've used Altera extensively before.

The free University version of MaxPlus supports VHDL. You can download it if
you are not at a university, of course. I'm not sure about Quartus. Xilinx
WebPack supports VHDL as well.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM
Email: aqzf13@...
My low-cost Philips LPC210x ARM development system:
http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller/lpc2104.html

Hi Leon,

> The free University version of MaxPlus supports VHDL. You can download it
if
> you are not at a university, of course. I'm not sure about Quartus. Xilinx
> WebPack supports VHDL as well.

Things *supposedly* had changed, I was recently told.
I got the "free" MaxPlusII a few years ago, and then out of nowhere it
*expired* and Altera
kept eedning me these annoying Emails to flog "plugins" worth 1000s of $$$.
I didn't like that, reason why I've avoided using Altera like the plague.

I always use Xilinx, and yes, Webpack actually has a darn good synthesiser
and fitter !!

-- Kris

Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB with 
an LPC2106 and FPGA on it. I was intending to use a Xilinx Spartan-3, 
but they are very difficult to get hold of, so I've decided to use 
the much easier to find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a few 
and will get them tomorrow.

The Cyclone chip shall be configured via the LPC2106, which will have 
a flash device for the configuration data interfaced to it. Most of 
the LPC2106 I/Os will be connected to the FPGA, with the other FPGA 
pins connected to headers for a daughter board. A socket for a DIL 
clock module will be provided with the clock output connected to a 
PLL input on the FPGA. The PCB will have four layers.

If anyone is interested in this project and would like to discuss it, 
please get in touch.

Leon

I would be interested by the algorithm or the source code for initializing
the FPGA, because I'm working too on project in which we have a LPC2106 and
a Cyclone chip.
Do think it's possible to do it with SPI port ?

Benjamin PRADAYROL


-----Message d'origine-----
De : leon_heller [mailto:leon_heller@...] 
Envoyé : lundi 5 avril 2004 15:37
À : lpc2000@yahoogroups.com
Objet : [lpc2000] LPC2106 and FPGA

Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB with an
LPC2106 and FPGA on it. I was intending to use a Xilinx Spartan-3, but they
are very difficult to get hold of, so I've decided to use the much easier to
find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a few and will get them
tomorrow.

The Cyclone chip shall be configured via the LPC2106, which will have a
flash device for the configuration data interfaced to it. Most of the
LPC2106 I/Os will be connected to the FPGA, with the other FPGA pins
connected to headers for a daughter board. A socket for a DIL clock module
will be provided with the clock output connected to a PLL input on the FPGA.
The PCB will have four layers.

If anyone is interested in this project and would like to discuss it, please
get in touch.

Leon



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----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Benjamin PRADAYROL" <benjamin.pradayrol@...>
To: <lpc2000@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 7:36 AM
Subject: RE: [lpc2000] LPC2106 and FPGA


I would be interested by the algorithm or the source code for initializing
the FPGA, because I'm working too on project in which we have a LPC2106 and
a Cyclone chip.
Do think it's possible to do it with SPI port ?

It might be but I was intending to bit-bang the configuration. I did this a
few years ago to configure an earlier Altera device with an ADI DSP. As I
recall, I had some problems getting the code to work properly but it wasn't
really all that difficult. I don't have that code any more, unfortunately.
My previous employer should still have it, and I might be able to get it
from one of my friends there. They've now dispensed with the FPGA, it was
primarily to get over a bug in their earlier ASIC.

Leon

One drawback to this is the size of sprom the ( and the size of the 
FPGA ) FPGA needs for configuration. If its a larger FPGA and you are 
going to emulate the load and include it in your firmware in the cpu, 
it may take a big bite out of your code space even if compressed. I'd 
lay pads for an sprom as an option too. Loading a Xilinx is well 
documented in their appnotes. -Lee


--- In lpc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Benjamin PRADAYROL" 
<benjamin.pradayrol@f...> wrote:
> I would be interested by the algorithm or the source code for 
initializing
> the FPGA, because I'm working too on project in which we have a 
LPC2106 and
> a Cyclone chip.
> Do think it's possible to do it with SPI port ?
> 
> Benjamin PRADAYROL
> 
> 
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : leon_heller [mailto:leon_heller@h...] 
> Envoyé : lundi 5 avril 2004 15:37
> À : lpc2000@yahoogroups.com
> Objet : [lpc2000] LPC2106 and FPGA
> 
> Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB 
with an
> LPC2106 and FPGA on it. I was intending to use a Xilinx Spartan-3, 
but they
> are very difficult to get hold of, so I've decided to use the much 
easier to
> find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a few and will get them
> tomorrow.
> 
> The Cyclone chip shall be configured via the LPC2106, which will 
have a
> flash device for the configuration data interfaced to it. Most of 
the
> LPC2106 I/Os will be connected to the FPGA, with the other FPGA pins
> connected to headers for a daughter board. A socket for a DIL clock 
module
> will be provided with the clock output connected to a PLL input on 
the FPGA.
> The PCB will have four layers.
> 
> If anyone is interested in this project and would like to discuss 
it, please
> get in touch.
> 
> Leon
> 
> 
> 
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--- In lpc2000@yahoogroups.com, "Lee Studley" <indigo_red@q...> wrote:
> One drawback to this is the size of sprom the ( and the size of the 
> FPGA ) FPGA needs for configuration. If its a larger FPGA and you 
are 
> going to emulate the load and include it in your firmware in the 
cpu, 
> it may take a big bite out of your code space even if compressed. 
I'd 
> lay pads for an sprom as an option too. Loading a Xilinx is well 
> documented in their appnotes. -Lee

I intend to use a serial flash memory for the configuration code.

Leon

"leon_heller" <leon_heller@...> writes:

> Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB with 
> an LPC2106 and FPGA on it. 
 ...
> the much easier to find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a few 

Do you have a feel for the power consumption of the FPGA?  I'm wondering
whether an FPGA would be feasible on an LPC2106 where low power (long
battery life) was a primary consideration.


-- 
Frank

--- In lpc2000@yahoogroups.com, Frank Sergeant <frank@p...> wrote:
> "leon_heller" <leon_heller@h...> writes:
> 
> > Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB 
with 
> > an LPC2106 and FPGA on it. 
>  ...
> > the much easier to find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a 
few 
> 
> Do you have a feel for the power consumption of the FPGA?  I'm 
wondering
> whether an FPGA would be feasible on an LPC2106 where low power 
(long
> battery life) was a primary consideration.

How long is a piece of string? 8-) It depends on the clock rate and 
how much current is taken by the I/Os. If you have a rough idea of 
the requirements the consumption could be estimated.

Leon

Frank
 
I work for a scientific research organization that places instruments on the ocean floor for long periods.  Our instruments live and die by power consumption.
 
Most of the SRAM based FPGAs have quiescent current consumption(i.e. no clocks) that will dwarf the current required by the LPC2106.   In order to achieve the density and speed required for the telecommunications market the MOSFETs used in these FPGAs are typically very leaky.  
 
Their gate threshold and bias voltages are very close resulting in a MOSFET that doesn't really turn fully on or off.  The quiescent current required by many devices can be on the order of 20 to 100 milliamps doing absolutely nothing.  Also, this quiescent current is exponentially dependent on temperature. 
 
Another thing to watch out for in the inrush/initialization current required by most of the
SRAM based FPGAs which can be on the order of amps.  Things change everyday in the
FPGA business so these comments may not apply directly to your specific part.  In other words, read that darn data sheet (carefully)!
 
For example, the Xilinx XC3S1000 typically requires 65 milliamps of quiescent current for the internal supply, VCCINT.  Another 25 milliamps is required for the VCCAUX supply. 
 
All is not lost, there are a few CPLD and FPGA like devices that feature low static power dissipation, here are a few recommendations:
 
1.  The Xilinx Cool Runner and Cool Runner II CPLDs (up to 512 macrocells)
2.  The Actel ProASIC and ProASIC+ FPGAs
3.  The Cypress Delta 39K family of CPLDs (up to 3072 macrocells)
4.  QuickLogic Eclipse II FPGAs
5.  Xilinx Spartan-XL (not Spartan 2, 3 or E) FPGAs
 
I have direct design experience with #1, 2 and 3 above but 4 and 5 may work for 
you as well.  I don't think the Quicklogic parts are re-programmable and cheap
HDL synthesis support for #5 is lacking.
 
I hope this helps...
Wayne

Frank Sergeant <frank@...> wrote:
"leon_heller" <leon_heller@...> writes:

> Some time ago I mentioned that I was thinking of producing a PCB with 
> an LPC2106 and FPGA on it. 
...
> the much easier to find Altera Cyclone EP1C3T100. I've ordered a few 

Do you have a feel for the power consumption of the FPGA?  I'm wondering
whether an FPGA would be feasible on an LPC2106 where low power (long
battery life) was a primary consideration.


-- 
Frank



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[re FPGA power consumption]

Thank you very much, Leon and Wayne, for the comments and suggestions.

I was thinking (vaguely) of building a one-size-fits-most board that
consisted primarily of an LPC2106 and a programmable logic chip of some
sort.  I'm just at the thinking stage, but I have some good leads thanks
to Wayne.

Another thought (sparked by a comment by Stephen Pelc, in
comp.arch.embedded) is the possibility of putting multiple LPC chips on
a single board, with the others as slave I/O processors, or whatever, to
the main chip, stuffing the extra CPUs only when they were useful for
the particular project, but using a "standard board".  I'm now leaning
toward thinking it would be better not to do that but to do a custom
board for each project, primarily to save on board complexity and cost
when the extras were not needed.  (Then, the "standard board" could be a
set of several variants in the CAD software.)

Along that line, perhaps running some of the LPC chips from very slow
external clocks could get their power consumption very low -- perhaps
for a keyboard scanner or other purpose where I might want some logic to
stay awake all the time but working very slowly would be adequate.
(De-tuning an ARM to the speed of a PIC or Atmel chip (?) and thus
getting PIC-sized power consumption, but keeping a single instruction
set.)

-- 
Frank