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Suggestions for Negative Scanner

Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by julieseltzergirl

Hello all,

For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and have
used it to scan in lots of 35mm negatives. 

I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 2k. 

I currently have it connected to an old win 2k laptop but the images
come out extremely grainy  and/or noisy.

I can't afford to spend more than $800 on a new scanner. Any thoughts
out there about what would be a good scanner purchase? 

I don't need a print scanner, and it seems that anything that is doing
both negatives and prints wouldn't do negatives as well.

Also, is it inevitable that I will get lots of grain? An example of
what I mean is at
http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg

Again, all I have are 35mm negatives, so perhaps I can't get better
quality than this.

Thanks in advance

julie

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Andre Moreau

Hello Julie,

Conventional wisdom would call for another dedicated 35mm scanner.
Having used a Nikon Coolscan V I can say that I've also encountered
the same problem with certain films, but that I could make really nice
grainless scan with Ilford FP4+. But that won't help with the
negatives that you already have.

Might I be so bold as to suggest an Epson V700 scanner whose Photo-I
review you will find at the link below. There is a section of the
review dealing with 35mm film scans.

http://www.photo-i.co.uk/Reviews/interactive/Epson%20V700/page_1.htm

Cheers,
Andre
www.andremoreau.com

RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by j brubaker

Julie - I too have recently been scanning alot of older film images.
I'm using a Minolta Multi-pro which has a good reputation as a pro-level
scanner, but I still get lots of grain - depending on the film.  When we
all shot film, we just accepted the grain as part of the photo process.
Now, with the smooth digital look we're getting more critical about it!
I've found that noise reduction software can help.  I took your Fritz
the cat image and ran "Noise Ninja" on it.  You can see the result at:
 
http://truepicture.com/fritz.jpg
 
Compare with the original, and you will see that it is a bit smoother,
and less noisy.  If I were you, I'd invest in some type of noise
reduction software and give it a try before buying another scanner.
Most of the software solutions have demos you can try before buying.
Good Luck ---john.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
julieseltzergirl
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:29 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner



Hello all,

For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and have
used it to scan in lots of 35mm negatives. 

I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 2k. 

I currently have it connected to an old win 2k laptop but the images
come out extremely grainy and/or noisy.

I can't afford to spend more than $800 on a new scanner. Any thoughts
out there about what would be a good scanner purchase? 

I don't need a print scanner, and it seems that anything that is doing
both negatives and prints wouldn't do negatives as well.

Also, is it inevitable that I will get lots of grain? An example of
what I mean is at
http://www.seltzerg
<http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg>
irl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg

Again, all I have are 35mm negatives, so perhaps I can't get better
quality than this.

Thanks in advance

julie



 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Eric Neilsen

Noise reduction indeed! I was quite unhappy with the quality of scans coming
off a Imacon Precision II and it has only been in the last year or so that
with the noise reduction software available and the sharpening tools that
satisfaction in the film to scan to print is starting to have more appeal;
like that of direct capture but with more work : (    

 

Neat Image, and Noiseware Professional by Imagnomic are worth a look as is
Noise Ninja. 

 

 

Eric Neilsen Photography

4101 Commerce Street

Suite 9

Dallas, TX 75226

http://e.neilsen.home.att.net

http://ericneilsenphotography.com

Skype ejprinter

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of j
brubaker
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 10:28 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

 

Julie - I too have recently been scanning alot of older film images.
I'm using a Minolta Multi-pro which has a good reputation as a pro-level
scanner, but I still get lots of grain - depending on the film. When we
all shot film, we just accepted the grain as part of the photo process.
Now, with the smooth digital look we're getting more critical about it!
I've found that noise reduction software can help. I took your Fritz
the cat image and ran "Noise Ninja" on it. You can see the result at:

http://truepicture. <http://truepicture.com/fritz.jpg> com/fritz.jpg

Compare with the original, and you will see that it is a bit smoother,
and less noisy. If I were you, I'd invest in some type of noise
reduction software and give it a try before buying another scanner.
Most of the software solutions have demos you can try before buying.
Good Luck ---john.



-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhit
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>
eThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhit
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>
eThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
julieseltzergirl
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:29 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhit
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>
eThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

Hello all,

For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and have
used it to scan in lots of 35mm negatives. 

I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 2k. 

I currently have it connected to an old win 2k laptop but the images
come out extremely grainy and/or noisy.

I can't afford to spend more than $800 on a new scanner. Any thoughts
out there about what would be a good scanner purchase? 

I don't need a print scanner, and it seems that anything that is doing
both negatives and prints wouldn't do negatives as well.

Also, is it inevitable that I will get lots of grain? An example of
what I mean is at
http://www.seltzerg
<http://www.seltzerg
<http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg>
irl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg>
irl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg

Again, all I have are 35mm negatives, so perhaps I can't get better
quality than this.

Thanks in advance

julie

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Alan Ansell

FWIW: I'm not a photographer and therefore don't have a great understanding of what would constitute a 'good' scan of a 35mm negative but going by the evidence of my own eyes and software/hardware I am thoroughly impressed by the results gained using an Epson 4990 flatbed scanner (which ships with a variety of film negative holders) and VueScan software/drivers.
The reason that I'm quite happy with the results - and where I may well differ from yourselves - is that my output sizes don't go beyond A3+. But one of the fascinating things about the VueScan software is that although you can set scan resolutions up to 6000 dpi, left in auto mode, the software makes a very intelligent guess of scan resolution based on output size. However much (I realise) that the following might sound like an anathema to you dedicated enthusiasts - or may simply be inappropriate to your needs - I have found from my own demonstrations that having an image for A4 printing output by the scanner at 150 - 240 dpi produces a superb print. No, it's not going to be gallery quality but neither have I ever seen the need for scan resolutions beyond 4800dpi - whatever the output size. There are extensive reviews of the Epson 4990 and 700 on the web - with valid comparisons with dedicated film scanners. Again depending on needs, personally I cannot see the advantages
conferred over my £200 scanner by a dedicated film model costing many times the price.

I've looked at quite a lot of noise reduction and filtering in Photoshop. My own experiences are that used well, Photoshop's tools (I'm using CS2 version) are really very good. There isn't anything out there I've found that offers any significant improvement except for the suite of tools from Nik Software - their sharpening and other image tools - like camera specific noise reduction tools which read RAW data from your camera - are (IMO) superb:

http://www.niksoftware.com/professionalsuite/en/entry.php?

Just my twopence worth.

-- 
  Alan Ansell
  aansell@...
Show quoted textHide quoted text
----- Original message -----
From: "j brubaker" <jb@...>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 11:27:57 -0400
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

Julie - I too have recently been scanning alot of older film images.
I'm using a Minolta Multi-pro which has a good reputation as a pro-level
scanner, but I still get lots of grain - depending on the film. When we
all shot film, we just accepted the grain as part of the photo process.
Now, with the smooth digital look we're getting more critical about it!
I've found that noise reduction software can help. I took your Fritz
the cat image and ran "Noise Ninja" on it. You can see the result at:
[1]http://truepicture.com/fritz.jpg
Compare with the original, and you will see that it is a bit smoother,
and less noisy. If I were you, I'd invest in some type of noise
reduction software and give it a try before buying another scanner.
Most of the software solutions have demos you can try before buying.
Good Luck ---john.
-----Original Message-----
From: [2]DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[3]DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
julieseltzergirl
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:29 AM
To: [4]DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner
Hello all,
For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and have
used it to scan in lots of 35mm negatives.
I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 2k.
I currently have it connected to an old win 2k laptop but the images
come out extremely grainy and/or noisy.
I can't afford to spend more than $800 on a new scanner. Any thoughts
out there about what would be a good scanner purchase?
I don't need a print scanner, and it seems that anything that is doing
both negatives and prints wouldn't do negatives as well.
Also, is it inevitable that I will get lots of grain? An example of
what I mean is at
[5]http://www.seltzerg
<[6]http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg>
irl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg
Again, all I have are 35mm negatives, so perhaps I can't get better
quality than this.
Thanks in advance
julie
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


References

1. http://truepicture.com/fritz.jpg
2. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com
3. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com
4. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com
5. http://www.seltzerg/
6. http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg
7. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/message/84790;_ylc=X3oDMTM2OW1sZWZpBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBG1zZ0lkAzg0ODAyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjIxOTE3NQR0cGNJZAM4NDc5MA--
8. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxdWExZ28wBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBG1zZ0lkAzg0ODAyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjIxOTE3NQ--?act=reply&messageNum=84802
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Gary W. Weaver

Hi All,

I agree with this approach for the most part.

A scanner should show you which side of the film the dust is on - it should
be that sharp(ugly).

From there, one refines focus and filters to produce the image.

I'm using a old CoolScanII for 35mm this year and my old ScanmakerIII's for
larger stuff. My second flatbed is so out of focus there is never any grain.

gar
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of j
brubaker
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 8:28 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner


Julie - I too have recently been scanning alot of older film images.
I'm using a Minolta Multi-pro which has a good reputation as a pro-level
scanner, but I still get lots of grain - depending on the film.  When we
all shot film, we just accepted the grain as part of the photo process.
Now, with the smooth digital look we're getting more critical about it!
I've found that noise reduction software can help.  I took your Fritz
the cat image and ran "Noise Ninja" on it.  You can see the result at:

http://truepicture.com/fritz.jpg

Compare with the original, and you will see that it is a bit smoother,
and less noisy.  If I were you, I'd invest in some type of noise
reduction software and give it a try before buying another scanner.
Most of the software solutions have demos you can try before buying.
Good Luck ---john.



-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
julieseltzergirl
Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2007 7:29 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner



Hello all,

For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and have
used it to scan in lots of 35mm negatives.

I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 2k.

I currently have it connected to an old win 2k laptop but the images
come out extremely grainy and/or noisy.

I can't afford to spend more than $800 on a new scanner. Any thoughts
out there about what would be a good scanner purchase?

I don't need a print scanner, and it seems that anything that is doing
both negatives and prints wouldn't do negatives as well.

Also, is it inevitable that I will get lots of grain? An example of
what I mean is at
http://www.seltzerg
<http://www.seltzergirl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg>
irl.com/scanex/img034_FritzInBathroom.jpg

Again, all I have are 35mm negatives, so perhaps I can't get better
quality than this.

Thanks in advance

julie







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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RE: [Digital BW] Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Eric Neilsen Photo

Then Alan, I think you should take a second look at noise reduction
software. It makes a hugh difference in many cases, and a very small
difference in a few. 

 

Eric Neilsen Photography

4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9

Dallas, TX 75226

214-827-8301

http://ericneilsenphotography.com

 

Skype : ejprinter



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by Steven Karafyllakis

Julie:


> I am finding that I am not entirely satisfied with the noise levels.
> Further, it seems that there are no drivers for this beyond Windows 
2k. 
> 

Try Vuescan, at http://www.hamrick.com  If you fins a solution for 
the grain and want to continue using the scanner, Vuescan will almost 
certainly support it beyond Win XP.

It also provides multi-sampling and multi-exposure scanning, which 
might help with the noise. Though if it's really the grain that's 
bugging you, the software approach is probaly more effective as 
others have suggested.

Steve Karafyllakis

http://www.stevekphoto.com

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-10 by jnhugo

--- In 
DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "julieseltzergirl" 
<jvandorejoinsstuff@...> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
> 
> For about 10 years I have used a Minolta QuickScan 35 plus, and 
have
>
Well that is a really good picture of the cat regardless of grain 
image. I use a nikon 8000 at work and a polaroid 120sprintscan at 
home. The polaroid produces beautiful scans but not until I started 
using vuescan. Huge difference compared to the Polaroid scan 
software that came with the machine. I also try to avoid any "work" 
in the scanner software and wait until I get into photoshop to 
adjust contrast etc. Just scan as normal as possible. In the image 
you posted i noticed the grain effect seems more pronounced in the 
center of the image. Is your film holder flat? Mine wasn't on the 
nikon and the polaroid, I had to buy the extra glass holders to get 
a flat scan.
But really, the Vuescan made a BIG difference, try the free trial 
and see if you don't see a big improvement in quality.
Jack

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by julieseltzergirl

wow, thanks everyone for the comments, as well as the private emails.
I think I am going to try the software solution first, and then
carefully look at scanners on the market. 

thanks much again

julie

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Daniel Ridings

julieseltzergirl wrote:
> 
> 
> wow, thanks everyone for the comments, as well as the private emails.
> I think I am going to try the software solution first, and then
> carefully look at scanners on the market.
> 
> thanks much again
> 
> julie

Julie,
You might not want to wait too long with a new scanner. They are a dying 
breed.

Daniel Ridings
http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by David Keenan

>Try Vuescan,

Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you want
software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation --
nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive technical
support.

I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
just plain awful.

Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.

I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson, Nikon, or
Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just fine.

Dave.

-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by edrudolpho

Until recently I used NikonScan, the software that came with my
scanner.  I had tried VueScan several times and found it clunky. 
However, when I began using Delta 100 film I tried VueScan again and
found that the current version is somewhat easier to use than previous
versions.  That said, if you've not used it before it might be good to
get someone to go over some of the fine points with you.  It is the
fine points that make it worth using.

Ed


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan"
<ausdlk@...> wrote:
>
> >Try Vuescan,
> 
> Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
> degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if
you want
> software that has anything more than the most rudimentary
documentation --
> nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
technical
> support.
> 
> I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a
high
> degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
> software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
> developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
> just plain awful.
> 
> Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
> 
> I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,
Nikon, or
> Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out
just fine.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> Dave.
> 
> -- 
> Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
> 2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
> 2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Steve and Ann Taylor

My experience has been just the opposite. I find Vuescan to be quite easy  
to use. It works with both my Epson 3200 and my CanoScan 4000 with the  
same basic interface. Once you get the hang of it, you can use any scanner  
supported, which is just about all scanners, without having to relearn a  
new interface for each one. That and the fact that Vuescan generally gives  
better results, make it the software of choice for me. Plus, it doesn't  
cost anything to give it a try. I've only had a couple occasions where I  
contacted Ed Hamrick with technical support questions and both times he  
was very responsive. He is continually updating, adding new scanners, and  
refining the program. I would not hesitate to recommend Vuescan for anyone  
to at least try.
Steve

On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 07:35:30 -0700, David Keenan <ausdlk@...> wrote:

>> Try Vuescan,
>
> Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
> degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you  
> want
> software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation  
> --
> nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive  
> technical
> support.
>
> I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
> degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
> software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
> developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
> just plain awful.
>
> Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
>
> I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,  
> Nikon, or
> Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just  
> fine.
>
> Dave.
>



-- 
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by jnhugo

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "David Keenan" 
<ausdlk@...> wrote:
>
> 
> I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson, 
Nikon, or
> Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out 
just fine.
> 
 I think that's the point, she is using the manufactureres software 
and is not satisfied with the results.
Jack

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Daniel Ridings

I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since sliced 
bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners. Works 
the same everywhere.

This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:

http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html

Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.

Daniel


David Keenan wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> 
>  >Try Vuescan,
> 
> Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
> degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you want
> software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation --
> nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive technical
> support.
> 
> I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
> degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
> software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
> developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
> just plain awful.
> 
> Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
> 
> I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson, Nikon, or
> Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just fine.
> 
> Dave.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Peter De Smidt

Also try scanning as a color image, and then look at the color channels 
in photoshop. With my scanner, the green channel gives the best results 
for scanning bw.  Vuescan allows you to pick with channel is used for 
the bw image, and so once you find out the best channel, you don't have 
to do a full color scan anymore.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Harry Lockwood

Beautiful image, Daniel, as are the others.  But I¹m one of those who has
tried Vuescan on a couple of occasions with little satisfaction.  I¹ve been
using NikonScan as a PS twain for my Nikon 4000 ED instead.  I have not been
able to determine why Vuescan is better.
However, if you¹re claiming that I will get a better scan with VS, then
maybe I¹ll have to go back and try it once again.  Sigh.

And BTW, I notice you¹re using an old Leica.  I am moving toward the
purchase of an M7.  I already have and use the 35mm Summicron asph. on my
Hexar RF.

(Some of my stuff can be seen at www.pbase.com/hlockwood.)

Again, great shots.

Harry Lockwood


On 4/11/07 1:17 PM, "Daniel Ridings" <dlr@...> wrote:

>  
>  
>  
> 
> I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since sliced
> bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners. Works
> the same everywhere.
> 
> This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:
> 
> http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html
> 
> Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.
> 
> Daniel
> 
> David Keenan wrote:
>> > 
>> > 
>>> >  >Try Vuescan,
>> > 
>> > Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
>> > degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you
>> want
>> > software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation --
>> > nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
>> technical
>> > support.
>> > 
>> > I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
>> > degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
>> > software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
>> > developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
>> > just plain awful.
>> > 
>> > Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
>> > 
>> > I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson, Nikon,
>> or
>> > Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just
>> fine.
>> > 
>> > Dave.
>  
>     


-- 

Harry F. Lockwood




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Daniel Ridings

Harry Lockwood wrote:
> 
> 
>  I\ufffdve been
> using NikonScan as a PS twain for my Nikon 4000 ED instead. I have not been
> able to determine why Vuescan is better.
> However, if you\ufffdre claiming that I will get a better scan with VS, then
> maybe I\ufffdll have to go back and try it once again. Sigh.
>

Not necessarily. Vuescan is better for me because I never have to 
relearn software when I get a new scanner (doesn't happen very often any 
more) or when I switch scanners (happens a lot). It is the later reason, 
switching from Nikon LS-5000 to an Epson flatbed, that keeps me using 
Vuescan. At the time, I didn't like Epson's software (I have an older 
scanner) and I never bothered opening Nikon's software. I was already 
using Vuescan with satisfactory results so I didn't see any reason to 
change.

But if you're getting good results with PS twain for Nikon 4000 ... 
there's no reason to change. There are so many other things in life that 
want our "excess" time.


> And BTW, I notice you\ufffdre using an old Leica. I am moving toward the
> purchase of an M7. I already have and use the 35mm Summicron asph. on my
> Hexar RF.
> 
> (Some of my stuff can be seen at www.pbase.com/hlockwood.)

Thanks Harry. I always enjoy browsing photographs.

Best,
Daniel

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by BlackMax Photo

As someone who had been using VueScan off and on since it's inception, I'd like to suggest that those having trouble with the software simply read the instructions. Though meager, the instructions DO explain what the controls are intended to do ... worked for me.

BC
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Harry Lockwood 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 1:59 PM
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner


  Beautiful image, Daniel, as are the others. But I¹m one of those who has
  tried Vuescan on a couple of occasions with little satisfaction. I¹ve been
  using NikonScan as a PS twain for my Nikon 4000 ED instead. I have not been
  able to determine why Vuescan is better.
  However, if you¹re claiming that I will get a better scan with VS, then
  maybe I¹ll have to go back and try it once again. Sigh.

  And BTW, I notice you¹re using an old Leica. I am moving toward the
  purchase of an M7. I already have and use the 35mm Summicron asph. on my
  Hexar RF.

  (Some of my stuff can be seen at www.pbase.com/hlockwood.)

  Again, great shots.

  Harry Lockwood

  On 4/11/07 1:17 PM, "Daniel Ridings" <dlr@...> wrote:

  > 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since sliced
  > bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners. Works
  > the same everywhere.
  > 
  > This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:
  > 
  > http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html
  > 
  > Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.
  > 
  > Daniel
  > 
  > David Keenan wrote:
  >> > 
  >> > 
  >>> > >Try Vuescan,
  >> > 
  >> > Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
  >> > degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you
  >> want
  >> > software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation --
  >> > nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
  >> technical
  >> > support.
  >> > 
  >> > I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
  >> > degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
  >> > software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
  >> > developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
  >> > just plain awful.
  >> > 
  >> > Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
  >> > 
  >> > I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson, Nikon,
  >> or
  >> > Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just
  >> fine.
  >> > 
  >> > Dave.
  > 
  > 

  -- 

  Harry F. Lockwood

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



   
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RE: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-11 by Gary W. Weaver

I never investigated Vuescan further than hitting some setting that took an
hour to preview.

You don't really need much for B&W scans.

For color negs, I got better scans with vuescan and it's mask match.

gar
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Steve
and Ann Taylor
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 8:09 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner


My experience has been just the opposite. I find Vuescan to be quite easy
to use. It works with both my Epson 3200 and my CanoScan 4000 with the
same basic interface. Once you get the hang of it, you can use any scanner
supported, which is just about all scanners, without having to relearn a
new interface for each one. That and the fact that Vuescan generally gives
better results, make it the software of choice for me. Plus, it doesn't
cost anything to give it a try. I've only had a couple occasions where I
contacted Ed Hamrick with technical support questions and both times he
was very responsive. He is continually updating, adding new scanners, and
refining the program. I would not hesitate to recommend Vuescan for anyone
to at least try.
Steve

On Wed, 11 Apr 2007 07:35:30 -0700, David Keenan <ausdlk@...> wrote:

>> Try Vuescan,
>
> Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
> degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you
> want
> software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation
> --
> nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
> technical
> support.
>
> I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a high
> degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
> software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while the
> developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being, well,
> just plain awful.
>
> Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
>
> I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,
> Nikon, or
> Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just
> fine.
>
> Dave.
>



--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/


Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
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Please follow these basic guidelines:
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- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
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FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
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RE: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-12 by Eric Neilsen Photo

As a user of Vue Scan and other scanning software, I ‘d add this. Any
software that hope to emulate B&W negs in any way is pushing the bound of
reality. I am sorry but to build in CI for film/developer combination is to
me absolute folly. There are so many thing that will happen to an image  in
the digital landscape that change the character of the image file, that
adding  “film grain that matches such and such film with this delevelop” is
so far removed from my reality that it completely ends up in the “what the
%*&%*&!$#! ? “ This goes back to painters asking the photographer why some
colors look different when they see a copy of their painting in chrome or
print! It is a different media!! 

 

That said, Vue Scan does seem to do a better job at B&W than does Nikon or
Silverfast. 

 

Eric

 

Eric Neilsen Photography

4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9

Dallas, TX 75226

214-827-8301

http://ericneilsenphotography.com

 

Skype : ejprinter

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of BlackMax
Photo
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 4:02 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

 

As someone who had been using VueScan off and on since it's inception, I'd
like to suggest that those having trouble with the software simply read the
instructions. Though meager, the instructions DO explain what the controls
are intended to do ... worked for me.

BC
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Harry Lockwood 
To: DigitalBlackandWhit
<mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com>
eThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

Beautiful image, Daniel, as are the others. But I¹m one of those who has
tried Vuescan on a couple of occasions with little satisfaction. I¹ve been
using NikonScan as a PS twain for my Nikon 4000 ED instead. I have not been
able to determine why Vuescan is better.
However, if you¹re claiming that I will get a better scan with VS, then
maybe I¹ll have to go back and try it once again. Sigh.

And BTW, I notice you¹re using an old Leica. I am moving toward the
purchase of an M7. I already have and use the 35mm Summicron asph. on my
Hexar RF.

(Some of my stuff can be seen at www.pbase.com/hlockwood.)

Again, great shots.

Harry Lockwood

On 4/11/07 1:17 PM, "Daniel Ridings" <dlr@dlridings.
<mailto:dlr%40dlridings.se> se> wrote:

> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since sliced
> bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners. Works
> the same everywhere.
> 
> This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:
> 
> http://www.dlriding <http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html>
s.com/paw2007/14.html
> 
> Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.
> 
> Daniel
> 
> David Keenan wrote:
>> > 
>> > 
>>> > >Try Vuescan,
>> > 
>> > Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
>> > degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor if you
>> want
>> > software that has anything more than the most rudimentary documentation
--
>> > nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
>> technical
>> > support.
>> > 
>> > I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without a
high
>> > degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
>> > software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that while
the
>> > developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being,
well,
>> > just plain awful.
>> > 
>> > Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
>> > 
>> > I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,
Nikon,
>> or
>> > Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out just
>> fine.
>> > 
>> > Dave.
> 
> 

-- 

Harry F. Lockwood

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Messages in this topic (0) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic 
Messages 
Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

http://groups. <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint>
yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

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Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
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Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-12 by David Keenan

>Vuescan is better for me

I have no doubt that VS is capable of making excellent scans.

I have tried to use it recently with an Epson V750 to scan medium format
6x4.5 negatives with the betterscanning.com dual MF film holder.

Getting VS to create and maintain predictable framing of two strips of four
frames using this holder was incredibly complex and convoluted.
Took oountess hours to figure out how to do it and even then each new scan
cycle requires more messing around to get the frames to align again.

The documentation in this regard is useless.

Maybe my distaste for VS comes from trying to use it for something other
than vanilla 35mm scans using the stock Epson holders.

But in this day and age not being able to grab a marquee around a frame to
resize and move it (something EpsonScan can do) is down right ridiculous.

If I am missing something related to easier scanning with VS then I stand
ready to be corrected -- so please let me know...

Dave.

-- 
Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-12 by Ernst Dinkla

David Keenan wrote:
>> Vuescan is better for me
> 
> I have no doubt that VS is capable of making excellent scans.
> 
> I have tried to use it recently with an Epson V750 to scan medium format
> 6x4.5 negatives with the betterscanning.com dual MF film holder.
> 
> Getting VS to create and maintain predictable framing of two strips of four
> frames using this holder was incredibly complex and convoluted.
> Took oountess hours to figure out how to do it and even then each new scan
> cycle requires more messing around to get the frames to align again.
> 
> The documentation in this regard is useless.
> 
> Maybe my distaste for VS comes from trying to use it for something other
> than vanilla 35mm scans using the stock Epson holders.
> 
> But in this day and age not being able to grab a marquee around a frame to
> resize and move it (something EpsonScan can do) is down right ridiculous.
> 
> If I am missing something related to easier scanning with VS then I stand
> ready to be corrected -- so please let me know...
> 
> Dave.
> 
Read the manual as someone suggested. The framing + crop 
isn't the most user friendly aspect of Vuescan but it has 
many features including a changeable border where no light 
measurement is done and more like that.

The suggestion that it only works with the OEM holders isn't 
true, I couldn't have done all the wet mounting methods I 
developed for the Nikon 8000 and the Epson Perfection models 
years ago if Vuescan was limited to the OEM holders windows.

Met vriendelijke groeten,  Ernst


|  Dinkla Grafische Techniek  |
|     www.pigment-print.com    |
|             ( unvollendet )            |

[Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-12 by djon43

I use Vuescan and Nikonscan with my Nikon V, Vuescan and Epson with my
flatbed. 

I have had no problems with any of them, or with Minolta's
application, with the exception that Vuescan doesn't as conveniently
control film advance with the motorized Nikon SA21 carrier...I use
Nikonscan with color negs only. 

Vuescan's front end seems initially complex, but that's mostly because
it involves linear logic and lacks cartoons and graphics that make
other apps seem more friendly. I like being able to use the same
scanning workflow on both my flatbed and my Nikon, and it worked well
on my Minolta, while that briefly functioned. 

The performance advantage of Vuescan over Nikonscan, that I find
convincing, is with silver B&W. 1) It may not exaggerate grain as much
as Nikonscan. 2) Its "slight grain reduction" setting definitely does
prevent grain exaggeration and it does not soften the grain or degrade
finest detail. This makes post processing applications related to
grain and noise unnecessary, if they ever were necessary to Photoshop
users. 

You'll find, if you follow posts on this topic on other sites, that
there is an individual who continually damns Vuescan, even damning the 
man behind it as a person. When somebody reports huge and continuing
problems with Vuescan, this is sometimes the story. Personally, I've
never had a problem with Vuescan in 98 or XP, but I've heard
real-sounding complaints with Mac.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Daniel Ridings
<dlr@...> wrote:
>
> I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since
sliced 
> bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners.
Works 
> the same everywhere.
> 
> This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:
> 
> http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html
> 
> Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.
> 
> Daniel
> 
> 
> David Keenan wrote:
> > 
> > 
> >  >Try Vuescan,
> > 
> > Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
> > degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor
if you want
> > software that has anything more than the most rudimentary
documentation --
> > nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
technical
> > support.
> > 
> > I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without
a high
> > degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
> > software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that
while the
> > developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being,
well,
> > just plain awful.
> > 
> > Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
> > 
> > I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,
Nikon, or
> > Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out
just fine.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> > 
> > Dave.
>

RE: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-12 by Globe Trotteur

I have been thinking about the V750 for my B&W and maybe using the fluid 
mount. Does this scanner meet the expectations? Reviews said that it is 
close to a drum scanner.
Thanks.
PO


>From: "David Keenan" <ausdlk@...>
>Reply-To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner
>Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 21:14:51 -0500
>
> >Vuescan is better for me
>
>I have no doubt that VS is capable of making excellent scans.
>
>I have tried to use it recently with an Epson V750 to scan medium format
>6x4.5 negatives with the betterscanning.com dual MF film holder.
>
>Getting VS to create and maintain predictable framing of two strips of four
>frames using this holder was incredibly complex and convoluted.
>Took oountess hours to figure out how to do it and even then each new scan
>cycle requires more messing around to get the frames to align again.
>
>The documentation in this regard is useless.
>
>Maybe my distaste for VS comes from trying to use it for something other
>than vanilla 35mm scans using the stock Epson holders.
>
>But in this day and age not being able to grab a marquee around a frame to
>resize and move it (something EpsonScan can do) is down right ridiculous.
>
>If I am missing something related to easier scanning with VS then I stand
>ready to be corrected -- so please let me know...
>
>Dave.
>
>--
>Web Site: www.david-keenan.com
>2007 PAW: www.david-keenan.com/paw
>2006 EuroBlog: www.david-keenan.com/euroblog
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

_________________________________________________________________
Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon. 
http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglineapril07

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-13 by Peter De Smidt

> I have been thinking about the V750 for my B&W and maybe using the fluid
> mount. Does this scanner meet the expectations? Reviews said that it is
> close to a drum scanner.
> Thanks.
> PO

I don't recommend it.  The Epson glass carrier involves mounting on the 
top of the glass. Hence, the sensor has to go through another two glass 
surfaces.  Get the cheaper Epson (or Canon 9950f, which is the one I 
have.)  Get a piece of  optical glass, mylar scaning overlays, Kami 
fluid and tape. I also use a rubber brayer to push down the 
mylar/film/Kami sandwich. The idea is to mount the negative on the 
bottom of the glass using Mylar and Kami.  Then use four feet (I use 
pieces of tape) on each corner of the glass to raise the negative to the 
ideal height for your scanner. Make a mask to set on top of the glass 
out of opaque material to keep out stray light, and make sure not to 
block the calibration area of the scanner. Then practice mounting with 
spare negatives.  I could go into more detail if you go this route.

-Peter
www.desmidt.net

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-13 by Un Globe Trotteur

Thanks Peter. I also do scan color negs. Do you still recommend on the cheaper scanner? Does the glass carrier mounts on top of the glass for both color & black & white or only for the fluid mount?
Sincerely,
Pierre-Olivier
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Peter De Smidt 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2007 8:58 PM
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner


  > I have been thinking about the V750 for my B&W and maybe using the fluid
  > mount. Does this scanner meet the expectations? Reviews said that it is
  > close to a drum scanner.
  > Thanks.
  > PO

  I don't recommend it. The Epson glass carrier involves mounting on the 
  top of the glass. Hence, the sensor has to go through another two glass 
  surfaces. Get the cheaper Epson (or Canon 9950f, which is the one I 
  have.) Get a piece of optical glass, mylar scaning overlays, Kami 
  fluid and tape. I also use a rubber brayer to push down the 
  mylar/film/Kami sandwich. The idea is to mount the negative on the 
  bottom of the glass using Mylar and Kami. Then use four feet (I use 
  pieces of tape) on each corner of the glass to raise the negative to the 
  ideal height for your scanner. Make a mask to set on top of the glass 
  out of opaque material to keep out stray light, and make sure not to 
  block the calibration area of the scanner. Then practice mounting with 
  spare negatives. I could go into more detail if you go this route.

  -Peter
  www.desmidt.net


   

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-14 by Peter De Smidt

> Thanks Peter. I also do scan color negs. Do you still recommend on the 
> cheaper scanner? Does the glass carrier mounts on top of the glass for 
> both color & black & white or only for the fluid mount?
> Sincerely,
> Pierre-Olivier
You'd only use the homemade glass carrier for use with wet-mounting.  
You could use it for both color and bw, although some films will benefit 
more than others.  All curly films will benefit, though, because they'll 
be held very flat.  You can try mounting negatives below the glass with 
tape but no fluid, but you will probably get Newton's rings.  You can 
use anti-Newton glass (or what's cheaper Anti-glare picture framing 
glass). Both of these have a texture that minimizes the rings.  
Depending on your scanner, though, the texture might show up in your scans.

-Peter

[Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-14 by Sergei Antonov

I used Canon 9950 and returned it. Then I used Minolta Dimage Pro, 
and it died recently and was bought back by Sony. I spent the pay 
back to Epson V750. I was skeptical when I ordered it, but there are  
few options for MF film scanner on the market. Today, several weeks 
later I could tell that this machine is better than Canon. On scans 
up to 1600 dpi it produces images about the same quality as Minolta. 
You could modify OEM holders and live with it, no need to pay Doug 
Fisher, and you could wet mount your film on the bottom of the glass 
on Epson wet mount holder.
Besides of wet mount holder (in US) V750 package adds useful software 
and IT8 target. In my opinion it does worth extra $200 even without  
holder.
If you want to build home made holder and don't need SilverFast and 
IT8 target, you could buy V700, it still will be better than 9950f, 
and probably better than Epson 4990.

--Sergei

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Peter De Smidt 
<pdesmidt@...> wrote:
>
> > Thanks Peter. I also do scan color negs. Do you still recommend 
on the 
> > cheaper scanner? Does the glass carrier mounts on top of the 
glass for 
> > both color & black & white or only for the fluid mount?
> > Sincerely,
> > Pierre-Olivier
> You'd only use the homemade glass carrier for use with wet-
mounting.  
> You could use it for both color and bw, although some films will 
benefit 
> more than others.  All curly films will benefit, though, because 
they'll 
> be held very flat.  You can try mounting negatives below the glass 
with 
> tape but no fluid, but you will probably get Newton's rings.  You 
can 
> use anti-Newton glass (or what's cheaper Anti-glare picture framing 
> glass). Both of these have a texture that minimizes the rings.  
> Depending on your scanner, though, the texture might show up in 
your scans.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> -Peter
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-14 by Alan Ansell

Just a suggestion this to see if I can be of any help: I have an Epson 4990. No, it's obviously not as good as some of the models being discussed here but does for me. If it would help anyone evaluate a new scanner, I would be quite happy to scan a known image and post it somewhere to this site. You would need to establish some sort of benchmark ie resolution, processing (filtering) or lack thereof etc. I don't have a glass mount.

We could compile an unofficial batch of scans of the same image done by people with different scanner models and then could see side by side the results vs price comparison.

-- 
  Alan Ansell
  aansell@...
Show quoted textHide quoted text
----- Original message -----
From: "Sergei Antonov" <antonovsergei@...>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 08:32:21 -0000
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

I used Canon 9950 and returned it. Then I used Minolta Dimage Pro,
and it died recently and was bought back by Sony. I spent the pay
back to Epson V750. I was skeptical when I ordered it, but there are
few options for MF film scanner on the market. Today, several weeks
later I could tell that this machine is better than Canon. On scans
up to 1600 dpi it produces images about the same quality as Minolta.
You could modify OEM holders and live with it, no need to pay Doug
Fisher, and you could wet mount your film on the bottom of the glass
on Epson wet mount holder.
Besides of wet mount holder (in US) V750 package adds useful software
and IT8 target. In my opinion it does worth extra $200 even without
holder.
If you want to build home made holder and don't need SilverFast and
IT8 target, you could buy V700, it still will be better than 9950f,
and probably better than Epson 4990.
--Sergei
--- In [1]DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Peter De Smidt
<pdesmidt@...> wrote:
>
> > Thanks Peter. I also do scan color negs. Do you still recommend
on the
> > cheaper scanner? Does the glass carrier mounts on top of the
glass for
> > both color & black & white or only for the fluid mount?
> > Sincerely,
> > Pierre-Olivier
> You'd only use the homemade glass carrier for use with wet-
mounting.
> You could use it for both color and bw, although some films will
benefit
> more than others. All curly films will benefit, though, because
they'll
> be held very flat. You can try mounting negatives below the glass
with
> tape but no fluid, but you will probably get Newton's rings. You
can
> use anti-Newton glass (or what's cheaper Anti-glare picture framing
> glass). Both of these have a texture that minimizes the rings.
> Depending on your scanner, though, the texture might show up in
your scans.
>
> -Peter
>


References

1. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com
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3. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxNGk5bGw5BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBG1zZ0lkAzg0OTE3BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjUzOTU4OA--?act=reply&messageNum=84917
4. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJlYTlucmxkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjUzOTU4OA--
5. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJlM2FjcWlvBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA21zZ3MEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjUzOTU4OA--
6. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
7. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
8. http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkanBydDYxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMTc2NTM5NTg4
9. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJmODVwN2Q3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3N0bmdzBHN0aW1lAzExNzY1Mzk1ODg-
  10. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-digest@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email%20Delivery:%20Digest
  11. mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change%20Delivery%20Format:%20Traditional
  12. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYjc3ZzFmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2hwZgRzdGltZQMxMTc2NTM5NTg4
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  16. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint;_ylc=X3oDMTJlOG82bW41BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM3MDIzMTEEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDE5MTgyBHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTE3NjUzOTU4OA--
  17. http://groups.yahoo.com/gads;_ylc=X3oDMTJjcDM4cWoyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzEEZ3JwSWQDMzcwMjMxMQRncnBzcElkAzE3MDUwMTkxODIEc2VjA3NsbW9kBHN0aW1lAzExNzY1Mzk1ODg-?t=ms&k=Fine+art+photography&w1=Fine+art+photography&w2=Digital+photography&w3=Digital+photography+print&w4=Digital+photography+technique&w5=Fine+art+photography+print&c=5&s=149&g=2&.sig=AhyJLEY_mHSSQCNHMyZ1HQ
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  22. http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12ijsab48/M=493064.9803190.10510181.8674578/D=groups/S=1705019182:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1176546788/A=3848608/R=0/SIG=12tfavs0n/*http://news.yahoo.com/i/703;_ylt=A9FJqaMFvq5EPlMBfBKPU80F;_ylu=X3oDMTA2NWJlcmlsBHNlYwN0bg--
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Re: [Digital BW] Re: Suggestions for Negative Scanner

2007-04-14 by Harry Lockwood

After reading these posts, I went back and downloaded VS to try again, for
the 3rd time.  Surely, I must have been missing something.  Unfortunately, I
came away with the same impression as before: NikonScan (with the 4000 ED)
is far preferable in my system (Mac OS 10.4.9), hands down.

I thought that specifying the specific film type in VS, in this instance
XP2/400, and following directions carefully, would give VS an edge.  It
didn¹t happen.  The NS raw scan, in simple B&W mode, was far superior.  The
VS scan would have required some heavy tonal correction in PS compared to
what had to be done for the NS scan.

I guess we Mac users are just less tolerant of struggling with difficult
interfaces, and struggle I did with VS.  Maybe as djon43 implies, VS is
friendlier to the Wintel, rather than the Mac, world.  Or maybe there are
some hidden secrets in the documentation that I was too lazy to ferret out.
In any event, I¹m finished with the experiment.

Harry Lockwood


On 4/12/07 11:04 AM, "djon43" <djon43@...> wrote:

>  
>  
>  
> 
> I use Vuescan and Nikonscan with my Nikon V, Vuescan and Epson with my
> flatbed. 
> 
> I have had no problems with any of them, or with Minolta's
> application, with the exception that Vuescan doesn't as conveniently
> control film advance with the motorized Nikon SA21 carrier...I use
> Nikonscan with color negs only.
> 
> Vuescan's front end seems initially complex, but that's mostly because
> it involves linear logic and lacks cartoons and graphics that make
> other apps seem more friendly. I like being able to use the same
> scanning workflow on both my flatbed and my Nikon, and it worked well
> on my Minolta, while that briefly functioned.
> 
> The performance advantage of Vuescan over Nikonscan, that I find
> convincing, is with silver B&W. 1) It may not exaggerate grain as much
> as Nikonscan. 2) Its "slight grain reduction" setting definitely does
> prevent grain exaggeration and it does not soften the grain or degrade
> finest detail. This makes post processing applications related to
> grain and noise unnecessary, if they ever were necessary to Photoshop
> users. 
> 
> You'll find, if you follow posts on this topic on other sites, that
> there is an individual who continually damns Vuescan, even damning the
> man behind it as a person. When somebody reports huge and continuing
> problems with Vuescan, this is sometimes the story. Personally, I've
> never had a problem with Vuescan in 98 or XP, but I've heard
> real-sounding complaints with Mac.
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint%40yahoogroups.com> , Daniel Ridings
> <dlr@...> wrote:
>> >
>> > I have been using Vuescan for about 5 years now. Best thing since
> sliced 
>> > bread in my opinion. One piece of software for all of my scanners.
> Works 
>> > the same everywhere.
>> > 
>> > This was done with it and the b/w print is even more beautiful:
>> > 
>> > http://www.dlridings.com/paw2007/14.html
>> > 
>> > Don't go in to the darkroom either if you don't want to learn things.
>> > 
>> > Daniel
>> > 
>> > 
>> > David Keenan wrote:
>>> > > 
>>> > > 
>>>> > >  >Try Vuescan,
>>> > > 
>>> > > Don't try it, though, if you want scan software that doesn't require a
>>> > > degree in both computer science and scanner design to use -- nor
> if you want
>>> > > software that has anything more than the most rudimentary
> documentation --
>>> > > nor if you want software that is backed up with timely, responsive
> technical
>>> > > support.
>>> > > 
>>> > > I own it and have tried to use it numerous times and never without
> a high
>>> > > degree of frustration. I have 30+ years experience with computers and
>>> > > software development so I'm hardly a novice-- and I think that
> while the
>>> > > developer of Vuescan may mean well, this product borders on being,
> well,
>>> > > just plain awful.
>>> > > 
>>> > > Silverfast is marginally better but it has its own issues.
>>> > > 
>>> > > I pretty much end up using the manufacturers software be it Epson,
> Nikon, or
>>> > > Minolta. These are far easier to operate and the results come out
> just fine.
>>> > > 
>>> > > Dave.
>> >
> 
>  
>     


-- 

Harry F. Lockwood




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